Late Roman dished shield

[m. demetrius]

Hello, all,
I'm starting a project that includes making at least 4 4th Century Late Roman Infantry shields. They were reportedly dished, but I can't seem to locate a number on how deep the dish should be. My guess is somewhere around 7 or so cm. But that's just a guess. The shields are being made in the same dimensions as those on Fectio, but so far, no answer from there on the depth of the dish. They're about .95m x 1.1m.

Any helps appreciated.

Thanks.

[Graham Sumner]

Hi

There are some plank shields from Dura Europos in Syria which are dished. They are published in a number of publications but the most detail is the the report on the military finds from the site by Simon James. There are also some late Roman shields from Egypt which are round rather than oval and which also appear to be dished too. I can get details of those for you if you wish.

In the meantime there is a French website which gives you some information on making dished shields. Adrian Wink from Armamentaria orders shields from there but they retail at around the £350 mark. If you ask Adrian or alternatively go on to Roman Army Talk you should get the information you need from the late Roman army guys.

Graham.

[Medicus Matt]

Graham, he's a moderator on RAT.

David, thought you'd have realised that if nobody on RAT knows then NOBODY knows....

[Medicus Matt]

Dug Simon James' Dura report out of the book room to see what he had to say about the oval shields found there.

Average is 1.05m high by 0.9m wide. Board thickness at centre under the boss was 9mm, tapering down to 3-5mm at the edges. Covexity is impossible to judge accurately due to post depositional distortion (some of them show no sign at all and may well have just been flat ovals) but he estimates that the high point at the centre would be 10 cm above the height of the rim (as evidenced by the remains of shield 619, where some planks were still curved)

Looking at the drawings of the surviving boards, most of the concavity must have been achieved by shaping/carving/planing after assembly, as the planks themselves don't seem to show much evidence of the tapering needed at the top and bottom to allow a barrel stave construction. You can get a good curve in one plane by butting parallel edged boards but to get a real lenticular shape you have to shape the boards either before or after assembly.
The boards do show signs of having been shaped with a plane or draw knife.

Holes for the attachment of the leather/hide rims are about 8-10mm in from the edge and 6-9 mm apart.

[Graham Sumner]

Thanks Matt

I was just going to direct him to a new thread on RAT on how to make dished shields!

Just realised he has not added his real name here and that it was the same person who had started the post on RAT!

Graham.

[m. demetrius]

@Matt Well, not all knowledge is contained on RAT. Heh. I'll add my name in sig right away. There, done.

@Graham Thanks for the reply. I'm working on some tests right now, that may make it possible to dish a shield, and basically, I'll settle for what the wood is willing to do. I have to make 4 or 5 of them, and the math to make the shield press escapes me. I'm trying a more boneheaded, simplistic approach. I'll let folks know what happens, and how I did whatever I end up doing. You can be sure, though, that if I can figure it out, anybody can do it.