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Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 6:49 pm
by WhiteWolf
JC Milwr wrote:Cue Blackadder 3 quote....

On looking at a cheap ermine cloak:
"Oooo, look at that, real cat!"

PS SCA is the Society for Creative Anachronism, an American invention to make up for the lack of real history ;) (Googling will give you more than you ever wanted to know).
Cheers

i off a googling :shock:

Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 8:03 pm
by gregory23b
Alan E, actually the peasant comment was a general one not even as a merlot fuelled knee jerk response *hic* It got me thinking is all, which is highly dangerous at the best of times.

Chickster - yes the estates model is fine in principle but in say 15th it is all awash with reality like a rising mercantile class who are often very wealthy but not en-nobled, greater land ownership etc Your summary is actually crucial to my point, the terms of reference are askew or more precisely our view on what is a peasant is a raggedy arsed yokel who eats mud rather than an untitled person in the classical sense - regardless of cash status. It is this image that prevails in some quarters and to me is what most people, certainly the anon individual I was referring to earlier as he was talking in far too simplistic dare I say stereotypical terms.

It might be nice to actually see a very lowly portrayal with the cloth according to his/her rank, gnarled and work hardened hands.

Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 11:09 am
by WhiteWolf
After all this discussion the Sumptuary Law of 1363 was repealed the following year. :shock:

WW 8)

Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 8:19 pm
by Cat
Yes, I are very miffled, and am holding onto all of me fur, thankyou very much! Except the leg-hairs, but you'll have to have them sheared, not attached to pelt.


(BTW has anybody told Alan yet that JC is very def'nitely and obviously not a 'man'? Sorry ducks!)


JC-didn't know you chaps are mounted archers-I've suddenly had an idea with hooves...--where've they all gone? Oy! Come back!
(Need to repeat to self: horses are expensive, mean, a worry and unnecessary stress, as relaxing to have about as a barbed wire hair-shirt an I don't even ride. They're still kinda cute though. and Bucket rides well...hmmm.)

Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 10:03 pm
by JC Milwr
Cat: Well the chappies poncing around in long boots are mounted archers, cos they are riding boots! Eric probably doesn't know much about horses, but no-one has ever asked...

Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 11:36 pm
by WhiteWolf
Don't tell me I have to put a bl@@dy horse on the shopping list :shock:

WW 8)

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:30 am
by JC Milwr
WW: Only if you have somewhere to store it during the winter!

We are after all a mixed bag of mounted archers, foot archers, closet clankies and people who only pick up a bow once a year. Not to mention the itinerent meat dehydrator (yes he is a member, just ;)), the nun, the cook, the seamstress and the child wrangler!

J

PS WW have you had any mailing list emails yet?

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:35 am
by WhiteWolf
JC Milwr wrote:WW: Only if you have somewhere to store it during the winter!

We are after all a mixed bag of mounted archers, foot archers, closet clankies and people who only pick up a bow once a year. Not to mention the itinerent meat dehydrator (yes he is a member, just ;)), the nun, the cook, the seamstress and the child wrangler!

J

PS WW have you had any mailing list emails yet?
A nun
A cook
and A Seamstress

Sounds like the start of a very rude joke........ :wink:

Yup just sent a mail to the list.

WW 8)

Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:24 am
by Alan E
Jorge, it was a correct challenge - the word is used loosely and needs defining (because of our modern assumptions of what a peasant was). It would be good to see a real small-farmer re-enacted, but those with the correct calluses are likely to be too busy working the land (OTOH I do know an ex-woodsman who could carry it off). I have the calluses on my shooting finger to be an archer, trouble is they'll have gone with a few weeks not shooting !

Cat, no I don't know JC ... did I make an assumption ? Sorry, missed that ;)

hmmm, beginning to guess which group you're with - you have another site ?

WW ... a few suggestions to get the feel of what life was like for the majority:
The modern scholarly one:
'Peasants and Landlords in Later Medieval England' E.B.Fryde (1996) ISBN 0 - 7509 - 2255 - 9

For an older and in some ways outdated view :
'English Social History (Chaucer to Queen Victoria)' C.M. Trevelyan ISBN 0 - 14 - --9982 - 4
this is very Victorian, but counteracts any rosy modern view with one biased in the opposite direction; does contain original references to justify itself.

'The Common People' JFC Harrison (1984) ISBN 0 - 00 - 686163 - 6
Again, references and quotes of primary sources interleaved with readable commentary.

Something less dry, which I find helps to show what medieval people wanted in their heroes :
'A Book of Medieval Outaws (Ten Tales in Modern English)' Ed: Thomas H Ohlgren (1998) ISBN 0 - 7509 - 2493 - 4

Not a real history (!) but good for the feel of the times :
'Katherine' Anya Seton (1954)
What K. finds at Hugh Swynford's estate is probably typical of how a manor could be ruined by neglect of a minor landholding knight. Knighthood didn't mean riches (it could mean poverty because of the outlay mandated by law) and a small landholding requires management.

Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:33 am
by WhiteWolf
Cheers Alan

Will add this lot to the book list, which seems to grow bigger by the minute never mind the day :D

WW 8)