15th C male gown issues!

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lidimy
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15th C male gown issues!

Post by lidimy »

Feeling a bit silly right now.. I always like to think that patterns are like recipes 'as long as you follow the instructions, it'll turn out fine!' but it really isn't. :(

I'm following the MTA instructions (pg 150-155), what with cutting the side seams on the straight of grain and the CF and CB on the bias. Except *something* has gone horribly wrong. In the colour piccies in the MTA, the folds/pleats are all falling towards the centre, but on my pattern (yes it is a teddy pattern!) the folds all fall away from the CF and are basically trying to follow the straight grain. What am I doing wrong?! Is it the shape of the teddy making the angle of the bias too... obtuse?

Please help... I'm really lost for ideas! Am I reading the instructions wrong?

Thanks!

Lid
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Post by Sophia »

Lidi,

Pleats on gown in picture hold that way as tacked - have a similar problem on Peter person's gown unless he wears a belt - I am intending to fix the pleats this winter as well as slightly alter the neckline in the front to improve the hand.

Sorry I never got back to you about it but you may want to consider this option on Peter bear's gown.

Hope to go shopping this week - up to my eyes in stuff to do with renting out Peter's late parent's house at the moment and in between that I am supposed to be prepping for Kentwell and dealing with a poorly Peter person.

Big hugs,

Soph :D
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Post by Shadowcat »

I have always cut the CF and CB seams on the straight, and don't usually have problems. (But then I don't use MTA at all.) And of course I don't know what shape - apart from Teddy - you are making.

Soph, sorry Peter is poorly - make him better, like a good wifey!

S.

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Post by lidimy »

Thanks Soph - I'm glad this isn't an isolated problem, I thought I was being dense!

Especially as the bottom of page 150 cautioned it as a garment only suitable for experienced sewing people :shock:

Shadowcat I'll try making the CF on the straight, and see how it falls then. The thing is, as the CF measurement is literally only 6.5", there is very little room for maneouvering, and if I try and alter the way the folds go, it really looks very forced and just nasty! So if that does work, I'll see whether the pleats need fixing :D Oh and also, whith the pattern I made, all the excess fabric goes towards the CF and it gets quite fitted under the arms :?

I don't suppose making both seams off the straight would be an idea would it? Or is that something that should never be done?

Sophia, pass my regards onto Peter :( must be the grotty weather...

and thanks for the help!
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Post by Colin Middleton »

Don't say that Lidimy, I've got to tackle one this winter and I don't know if I can aford the time for a "how to make coats course" with Sarah! It looks straight forward enought, but I'm a little worried by the warning...

Best of luck with it.
Colin

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Post by Jackie Phillips »

If the seam from collar to shoulder is curved downwards like a saucer rather than straight across, it helps the pleats lie from shoulder to centre waist.

Otherwise, you might not have enough fabric in the body of the coat, to get really good pleats it needs to be almost circular.

Hope that helps.

Jackie
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Post by Sophia »

Jackie is right - just had a look at the pattern for Peter person's gown and the shoulder seam is indeed curved and each panel is almost a quarter circle.

As I said before my main error was not making the front neckline deep enough which means that it doesn't sit properly on his shoulders when he wears it for any length of time BUT I will stress this was my first effort and this and the doublet were the first time I had ever done any serious tailoring for a man.

Another important thing is to have the grain of the fabric centre vertical on the body of the sleeve - the front split should run down the grain. (This is assuming you are not doing anything fancy in the pinking department).

Soph :D
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Post by Jackie Phillips »

The MTA can be really difficult to follow, though it is invaluable in so many ways.

It doesn't show the curve of the shoulder seam, I got this from Dave Rushworth's High Medieval Clothing booklet, and on the occasions when I need to make a pleated gown, it becomes essential.

I'm always surprised too about how much extra fabric it takes. A standard, non-pleated coat takes 3 metres, a pleated gown of the same length takes at least twice that, though more fabric gets wasted.

Jackie



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Post by Sophia »

Jackie,

Beg to differ about the curved shoulder seam. It is shown very clearly in the MTA, Fig. 20, p.154.

Soph :D

*who is sitting at home and trying not to be grumpy about no Kentwell due to having caught Peter C-H's throat infection*
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Post by lidimy »

OK, I'll try

a) curving the shoulder seam (it is only about 1.5cm long, but we can always try...)

and b) making it more circular. Is it possible to have both seams (CF and side) on the bias or would this result in tragedy?

Thanks guys. Must buy more calico, I can see that! Sophia, thanks for the tip on the sleeves, haven't even begun to think about them yet! :lol:

Colin - I hope your attempts will be successful. I'm sure they will, at least you have a proper size pattern to work with! :lol: :lol:
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Post by Sophia »

Lidi,

I would definitely put the side seams straight to the grain and the CF/CB on bias. Try cutting each piece as a straight quarter circle as it is such a small garment. Also as it is so small I think you can probably skip interlining or you will end up with too much bulk.

Soph :D
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Post by lidimy »

OK Soph! Will try that and keep you posted :D

You're right about the interlining for sure, his doublet has added a few pounds to him already :lol:
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Post by lidimy »

SCORE!

A happy looking bear sits here with his gown front pinned over his doublet... I think he's admiring the way the pleats all fall to the centre!!!


:D :D :D :D

Thanks all - each piece is now cut to 90 degrees :D
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