Artist impressions are not always fantasy and I woulkd wonder why such a minor detail would be included, they had hobs on pattens and who know what the foreigners do with their footwear

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There are references (e.g. Howard's Household Books) to "Arrow Girdels" i.e. belts specifically for arrows. In one of the few contemporary English Illustrations of archers arrows are shown tucked in the belt, and in at least on case in a small 'pouch' attached to the belt which is large enough to hold the heads, but not much else.gregory23b wrote:Nice pics as always Karen.
Also, do the Schilling Chronicles not offer the possibility of the belt arrows slightly tied in as well? Some dim recollection scratches at me.
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Jorge
Ref, the wicker baskets, where is the source for that? The bags seem right, again as per the Schilling Chronicles, where they show English arches with what appear to be bags, although they could be simplified cone shapes to show the actual shape of the arrows when in the belt, ie the sketch lines. I see wicker baskets on sale, but not been given a source for them, they make sense, but even so, any ideas?
Flesh&Blood wrote:I remember reading somewhere, dim and distant past, that arrows were transported in quantities known as sheafs or sheaves, containing 24 arrows. any provenance anyone knows of this? Also with regard to the heads on/off, when the commission went out, the fletcher provided the fletched shafts, the armourer/smith provided the heads, and in most cases as far as I know, the two artisans didn't work together, each provided his agreed number of items. Local sources for crossbow bolts down this neck of the wood had the quarrels being supplied being made of oak and fletched with goose feather, the quantity being 'boxes of x hundred', and the heads supplied different by the barrel, OK this is crossbow bolts, in the 13th C, but surely they wouldn't have changed the system of supply that much? Thoughts please?
Dave Key wrote:With regard to headed vs unheaded arrows ....
In the list of 'ordnance' taken by John Sturgeon to France in 1475 we find ...
In shevys of arowes of ix ynches cccl [24*350= 8400 arrows]
In arowys of viij ynches mccccl [1450 arrows]
In arowys of vij ynches vij[m] ccccclx [7560 arrows]
In arowys unheded ccxxvij shef [227*24 = 5448 arrows]
[...etc...]
Yah, Thanks Alan, but it was somewhere else as well, quite prominant if I reccolect, but I just can't remember whereAlan E wrote:Flesh&Blood wrote:I remember reading somewhere, dim and distant past, that arrows were transported in quantities known as sheafs or sheaves, containing 24 arrows. any provenance anyone knows of this? Also with regard to the heads on/off, when the commission went out, the fletcher provided the fletched shafts, the armourer/smith provided the heads, and in most cases as far as I know, the two artisans didn't work together, each provided his agreed number of items. Local sources for crossbow bolts down this neck of the wood had the quarrels being supplied being made of oak and fletched with goose feather, the quantity being 'boxes of x hundred', and the heads supplied different by the barrel, OK this is crossbow bolts, in the 13th C, but surely they wouldn't have changed the system of supply that much? Thoughts please?Dave Key wrote:With regard to headed vs unheaded arrows ....
In the list of 'ordnance' taken by John Sturgeon to France in 1475 we find ...
In shevys of arowes of ix ynches cccl [24*350= 8400 arrows]
In arowys of viij ynches mccccl [1450 arrows]
In arowys of vij ynches vij[m] ccccclx [7560 arrows]
In arowys unheded ccxxvij shef [227*24 = 5448 arrows]
[...etc...]
When I first started to shoot field archery most time I used to put 6 arrows in belt and heads into my back pocket those were the days I could not afford a quiver.It looks like there is nothing new.Langley wrote:I tend to stick arrows in my belt for fast shooting but I also have a large wicker basket for things with large barbed heads - the illustration of the French Archer looks like it might be a wicker contraption if somewhat smaller. I have also seen several interpretations of the leather spacers including them used on their own just to keep the fletchings separated a bit in the supply waggon. I also use a linen bag affair with a spacer sewn in about 2/3 of the way up. I believe some spacers are found with and some without holes round the edge. I can certainly draw bodkin type heads from that with no problem but also, the bottom of the linen bag is not sewn up. It is simply held closed with a string and when in use the top is closed off with the drawstring so allowing you to withdraw the arrow from the pointy end. The fletchings suffer no harm when pulled through the spacer and in fact, sometimes it helps realign them after transport. Not sure how I would manage to put my big broadheads into it at all though! Don't like sticking arrows in the ground. I know one captain of archers who feels the same, loets the archers do it then orders, archers, 10 paces forward.... In short, there is no definitive answer here but I suspect that if it works it would have been used, possibly in specific circumstances. We are in danger of generalising and trying to find a single "correct" way.
Sorry, but I don't understand this statement. Could you expand?glyndwr 50 wrote:or even what the bows even looked like.
There are some rather sweeping statements in this paragraph - What are your sources for this posting? It just seems to have been copied from an article rather than written ad hoc.glyndwr 50 wrote:The subject about quiver for arrows has been debated for many years .As has been stated earlier in this section.After 1066 the use of a quiver seems to be absent from that time onwards till around the 17th century.One theory is that because the english arrows were so long it made it rather awxward to draw from a back quiver ,as for a side quiver there is little or no evidence they were used.Arrow bags seem to be the norm ,or tucked into the waist belt,but as earlier stated ,arrows were stored in barrels or wicker made containers its not untill the 15th century that painting show cloth type bags.Its down to the film maker that the general concept has come about.As we all know the Mary Rose has given up a lot of unanswered secrets ,which we did not know about what type of arrows were used or even what the bows even looked like.The finding of the Mary Rose has unwittingly set a bench mark on the question of archery.Up till this time very little items conecteted with archery have survived .We have to rely on what was ritten down ,and what information that has been written is normally very late medieval.I find that it is generally excepted that some sort of bag was in use ,and these bags tend to vary in size and shape .Some are open at the top and have a tied bottom ,some have the tips upper most others have the tips down.Some even have an open top and bottom .One can't really say which is the right one to use for your period in reenactment.Its best to get an oppinion from your groups archer master to be on the safe side .That way at least you will have the same as the rest of the lads .If of course you find that its incorrect or someone comes up with info that give a better idea what quiver or container ( Bag ) you need you will have to go with what info is avalable us. Here is a little info that may be of interest,The word Quiver comes from the middle english Quivre which is from french origin circa 14 cent .
quiver2
• noun an archer’s portable case for arrows.
— ORIGIN Old French quiveir.