Bannockburn 2006

Yourselves, events, parties, costumes...

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zauberdachs
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Bannockburn 2006

Post by zauberdachs »

Hey there, a guy I know has recently given me some pictures he took at Bannockburn 2006 so I thought I'd post some of them that include random people I don't know just in case anyone is interested...
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bannock1.jpg
bannock2.jpg
bannock3.jpg
Last edited by zauberdachs on Sun Jan 22, 2006 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

guthrie
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Post by guthrie »

Cool, so the weather this year will be sunny with some clouds? That will be good. And it looks like there will be the same people there this year as last year. Shame yoru friend couldnt get any shots of the battle, I would like to know how its going to go, and whether they'll get more people to take part this year.

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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

there's more...
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bannock4.jpg
bannock5.jpg
bannock7.jpg
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

and more...
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bannock8.jpg
bannock9.jpg
bannock10.jpg
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

still more...
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bannock11.jpg
Last edited by zauberdachs on Mon Jan 23, 2006 7:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

last couple...
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banock12.jpg
Img0049.jpg
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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Simon_Diment
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Post by Simon_Diment »

The usual mix of nice kit and crap same as the previous year.

Nice piccies though

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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

I'm in image 0049 on the left holding the lochaber axe. Asides from making a set of hose and cutting off the red mohawk any constructive criticism from early 14th century costume buffs would be much appreciated :)
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

Lady Cecily
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Post by Lady Cecily »

I would say your tunic is too short, the sleeves too loose and there is probabl y not enough material in it.

What have you got on your feet and lower legs? I don't know of lower leg bindings in this period.

Yes you need split leg hose and once you get them you will need a longer tunic to cover your modesty.

I would expect a linen coif under your hat - but it's good to see a hat.


Lastly - why are you carrying that axe?
Caroline

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PaulMurphy
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Post by PaulMurphy »

OK, you asked for it.... :wink:

What can be seen of the shoes looks OK. The leg wraps are wrong, and are presumably to cover the top of the shoes or the bottom of the trousers. As you've already said, the trousers should be replaced by hose.

Under the hose, you need braes - think of Hawaiian shorts with a rolled waistline, made out of unbleached linen, which come down to at least mid thigh. Alternatively, Andy Goddard has some details of a sort of C13th nappy arrangement which looks interesting.

Showing your underwear is never a good idea in re-enactment, so the top half needs to be considerably longer. A linen undershirt which comes down to at least mid thigh is the base layer, over which you would have a linen or woollen tunic which is about knee length. The dark age tunic you're wearing is too short both in the body and the sleeves, and the neck decoration is unlikely for underwear.

If wearing armour, the over tunic would probably be removed to cut down on the heat retension.

The belt and pouch are probably passable from the little that can be seen, although at this period most belts seem to have had some plates attached, and were likely to be coloured. The head covering is OK, but a linen coif is more likely than what looks like leather.

The lochaber axe is something I'd definitely quibble with - if you have evidence for one before the C16th, I'd be interested in seeing it. Axes, yes. Lochaber axes with both ends attached to the shaft and with a hook on the back, I don't think so. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lochaber_Axe

See http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart ... tail&p=102 and Gwen's braes and hose pages for some picture examples. These aren't perfect either, but they're not bad.

The person behind you also has some problems - the doublet is 50 years too late, and distinctively so in its cut, and scandalously short length for this period. The trousers with pockets (jogging bottoms?) are terrible. The boots are completely wrong too, I'm afraid - more Apache than Braveheart. The belt looks like a £10 special from Burtons or somewhere similar, with a very clearly modern buckle, and is probably too wide for the C14th.

However, compared to the fur and victorian tartan in Bannock8.jpg (his walking boots are perhaps the best part of his kit, but why is he standing on a coat hanger - some weird Masonic belief, perhaps?), its great, and capable of being rescued. At least you're interested in advice and research...

Further reading:

1. The Medieval Tailor's Assistant: Making Common Garments 1200-1500, Sarah Thursfield. ISBN 0903585324 (very useful, with patterns)

2. Medieval Costume in England and France: The 13th, 14th and 15th Centuries , Mary G. Houston. ISBN 0486290603 (old but still has some relevance)

3. Arms and Armour of the Crusading Era, 1050-1350: Western Europe and the Crusader States v. 1, David Nicolle. ISBN 1853673471 (very good for examples of primary evidence, some of which includes soft kit as well as good evidence for the availability of plate armour at this period).

Best Wishes,

Paul.
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zauberdachs
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Post by zauberdachs »

Cheers, very useful :)

To surmise:
A longer linen shirt, mid thigh, with longer sleaves.
A woolen/linen over shirt, knee length.
Lose the wrappings (they were taken loosely from the Osprey "Scottish and Welsh Wars 1250-1400")

I have a few questions. What kind of decoration would be on the over shirt? Is braiding appropriate? Would the over shirt be split for legs? How/where do you attach 14th century hose without a doublet?

I bought 3m of unbleached linen the other day and just need to get my thumb out to start making all this costume...

Oh yeah, it was a multi-period weapons demonstration that I was collared into taking part in :) So the axe wouldn't make it onto the field.
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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Post by Lady Cecily »

What kind of decoration would be on the over shirt? Is braiding appropriate?
I don't think so. You don't see it on the illustrations - but I haven't yet studied all the surviving textiles. Someone is welcome to prove me wrong.
Would the over shirt be split for legs?
If you want to - I have a feeling that the higher up the social scale you get the more likely the tunic is to be split. But I have to do some more work on it yet.
How/where do you attach 14th century hose without a doublet?
To your braes and or belt through your braes. There are a number of methods people are using but I havn't identified one that is the best yet.
Caroline

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PaulMurphy
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Post by PaulMurphy »

Lady Cecily wrote:
Would the over shirt be split for legs?
If you want to - I have a feeling that the higher up the social scale you get the more likely the tunic is to be split. But I have to do some more work on it yet.
Looking at the examples provided by Mary Houston in "Medieval Costume in England and France - The 13th, 14th and 15th Centuries", the split seems to be fairly classless - figures 86 & 87 are from BM Harl.1527 (La Bible Moralisée, late C13th) and show labourers with knee-length tunics which are split either at the front, or over one leg, with the end of the flap tucked through the belt for ease of working.

Similarly, figure 88 from "Lives of the Offas" (1250) shows a woodsman with an offset front split, while the folio showing the arming of Offa shows the king with an unsplit tunic (http://www.imagesonline.bl.uk/britishli ... ht=2&idx=2)

The Medieval Tailor's Assistant reproduces folio 6 from the Holkham Bible Picture Book (BM Add 47682) on page 74, showing a mix of workers, some with splits and some without. Other images from this manuscript are available online, and show similar examples (e.g. http://www.imagesonline.bl.uk/britishli ... ht=2&idx=2)

Best Wishes,

Paul.
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Post by Lady Cecily »

Fair do Paul - I only said it was a feeling.
Caroline

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Post by guthrie »

For Braes and single leg hose, I find that you need a good, tight belt or piece of rope, not string. I use rope, with strips of leather, and make sure that both are tied tightly, the rope around my waist, and the leather tot he rope. Then the single leg hose feel fine and comfortable, do not sag annoyingly and are generally great. Why they switched to joined hose I am not quite sure.

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Post by Lady Cecily »

The movement to joined hose happens for exactly the same reason women go from stockings to tights in the 60's. When the mini skirt appeared you could see the top of the stockings - yes gentlemen you may anjoy this but women didn't.

From the 1340's on the mans tunic gets shorter and shorter - eventually becoming the doublet . Hence hose become joined so you don't see the braes and or any flesh.
Caroline

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Post by zauberdachs »

cunning :)
Do not be loath, diligent reader, to winnow my chaff, and lay up the wheat in the storehouse of your memory. For truth regards not who is the speaker, nor in what manner it is spoken, but that the thing be true - Nennius, 8th century

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