ECW Infantry Buff Coat

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STEENIE
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by STEENIE »

Here is another 'nice' buff coat on ebay :roll:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Buff-leather- ... 1e5a953e8b
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Chris T »

The e-bay one is, sadly, a typical example of what you often get on the internet these days.....

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Tod »

They sell the same armour etc as the other ebayer who was banned from here.

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Ranter »

New to this forum

Read the whole of this thread with interest. Wonder how you guys missed the chap standing offset centre in Franz Hals'
"Officers and Sergeants of the St Hadrian's Civic Guard."
Now there is an interesting "foot" "sleeveless" buff coat. I cannot say that there might not be a degree of artistic license in this painting (I just love the extended "epaulette like" armsyces.) but the garment is very interesting and shows clearly the "drape! mentioned in previous posts. After all, these were supposed to be portraits.....

http://www.backtoclassics.com/gallery/f ... ivicguard/

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STEENIE
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by STEENIE »

Ranter wrote:New to this forum

Read the whole of this thread with interest. Wonder how you guys missed the chap standing offset centre in Franz Hals'
"Officers and Sergeants of the St Hadrian's Civic Guard."
Now there is an interesting "foot" "sleeveless" buff coat. I cannot say that there might not be a degree of artistic license in this painting (I just love the extended "epaulette like" armsyces.) but the garment is very interesting and shows clearly the "drape! mentioned in previous posts. After all, these were supposed to be portraits.....

http://www.backtoclassics.com/gallery/f ... ivicguard/

Nice one! Well spotted!
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Dathi »

Dutch Schuttji paintings are full of buffcoats from 1610- ish to the 1650's

Try "Maaltijd van zeventien schutters van de Handboogdoelen onder kapitein Geurt van Beuningen 1613" for starters to "Officers and men of the Company of captain Cornelis de Graeff and lieutenant Hendrick Lauwrensz, 1642" or "Officers and Standard-Bearers of the Old Civic Guard by Caesar van EVERDINGEN 1657" or "Schutters van de compagnie van kapitein Jan Claesz. Vlooswijck en luitenant Gerrit Hudde, 1642" or "Schutters van de compagnie van kapitein Joan Huydecoper en luitenant Frans van Waveren, 1648" or "Schutters van het vendel van kapitein Abraham Boom en luitenant Oetgens van Waveren, 1623" or "The Company of Captain Albert Bas and Lieutenant Lucas Conijn 1645 Govert Flinck" to name just a handfull

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STEENIE
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by STEENIE »

This is still on Ebay

It is a f--- ing abortion!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Buff-leather- ... 1e5a953e8b
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Dathi »

Spotted this in the painting "Maaltijd van zeventien schutters van de Handboogdoelen onder kapitein Geurt van Beuningen 1613"

Look at the thickness in that shoulder :D
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Chris T »

I am particularly interested in the dark bands decorated buffcoats from the 1620s TYW buffcoats. There is at least one portrait showing these in the 'Swedish' Osprey book, and I seem to have seen another couple, but always in black and white.

Does anybody have any colour versions showing these bands: they seem to be dark and non metalic, but this is not clear in the B/W versions.

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Mark Griffin »

one in the Museum of ondon store has black bands. Or at least thats what you see in a passing glance but close up you can see its silver lace thats oxidised. Doubt a painter at the time would show that of course, but a handy thing to remember.
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Dathi »

Appears to be one with dark bands in the a painting "Civic Guardsmen from the Company of Captain Jacob Pieterszn Hooghkamer and Lieutenant Pieter Jacobszn van Rijn, 1628" from Dutch sources. All the other schutterij paintings from the same time frame seem to show silver or gold bands.

Oddly enough, by the 1630's that sort of banding largely disappears from Dutch schutterij paintings

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Chris T »

They seem to have been a short lived thing, only in the 1620s....the Swedish ones seem to have disapeared by the 30's as well.

This is quite interesting in itself, as this is before the Swedish intervention in the TYW, so implies more similarities between different nations than is sometimes thought...

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Dathi »

We forget just how mobile what we would call mercenary troops were and quite willing to move from army to army without a care. And just how many people, not just officers, travelled to various wars. Let's not forget that a considerable number of English, Welsh, Irish and Scots fought overseas, just as part of their education process. Nobody would refer to Sir Thomas Fairfax as a mercenary but Fairfax did fight in the Low Countries under Sir Horace Vere and not as part of an offical Crown force

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by steve stanley »

I think there were Dutch/Swedish links pre-dating the TYW.....Dutch were the arsenal of Protestant powers....
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Neibelungen »

The black part from those illustrations is a fabric backing of cloth or braid, which the lace is sewn down to. You can see a non-backed identical lace on the breeches. Simplifies the sewing process as it can be removed easily from the black and edge stitching braid down to thick leather would be a real pain.. The black can be tacked down eaily under the lace.

I'd suspect on the other illustrations it would be a couple of alternatives.. a plain black lace or cloth strip, a decorative leather oversewn with a fabric panel inserted (an imitation of slashing with a lace bound edge -- not really wanted on a solid buff coat) or a raised line of butt stitching (often seen bordering belts and sword hangers)
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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Chris T »

The ones I am talking about seem to be wide and plain: probably a woven ribbon type material.

They are certainly not a line of tunnel stitching, nor is there any indication of metal / false slashing etc. As to them being black, that is the problem: in the black and white illustrations they appear dark: but this could be anything from a red, blue, green or whatever, right through to black. That is why I am trying to establish if anybody knows of a couloured version.....

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Re: ECW Infantry Buff Coat

Post by Dathi »

Found this on the Rijksmusuem site

http://www.rijksmuseum.nl/collectie/SK- ... der-hoeven

The full size picture seems to show silver braid on a cloth backing

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