Battle of Bannockburn 2007

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Lady Wolfshead
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Post by Lady Wolfshead »

How about we put up a list of what we would like to see for the next Bannockburn and submit that to NTS?
Good idea. :)
A beer tent - we do, after all, need somewhere communal for the evenings.

Keeping the tartan ban

Better communications - people need to know in advance when the event is

Better publicity - the event will stand or fall dependent on publicity and as I've said, I'm quite happy to promote the event.
Agree with all of those. I'd also like to see some thought put into where the LH camps are put. At the moment they seem very spread about which makes it difficult for the public to see what there is and means that there is less opportunity for groups to interact with one another.
Lady Wolfshead wrote:

Taking a fairly longterm view, I think we should also consider what will happen in 2014 if we allow the Bannockburn event to fall by the wayside.

There are a number of us committed to avoiding that.
Great. On the point of working with NTS, I also feel we need to choose our "ambassadors" wisely so that we put the best case forward and also foster a better relationship. NTS are interested in promoting history and funding their organisation to support this, we know that a well-run event will help them achieve both those objectives.

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Post by Colin MacDonald »

Arkadian wrote:
Super! Can we just have them now, please, I'd be very interested to see them.
i said a couple of times previously, when it's finished i'll put a PDF of it here for your perusal.
That'd be great, but in the meantime, it'd be splendid to see the sources that you've turned up. Nothing fancy, just ISBN, author/title or whatever you've currently got, if it won't delay your article completion.

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Post by Ecce »

Should we split this thread so that we can talk about future Bannockburns without the political stuff getting in the way?

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Post by Tuppence »

temporarily locking, while splitting
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Post by Tuppence »

right, now unlocked.

I have split this thread into two (the other is http://livinghistory.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9798).

Please be aware that this thread is now for discussion of the re-enactment, and not scottish / english politics or nationalism, or flag burning.
I'll be watching both threads and will take action if the slagging off of recent hours (by a very few) continues.


I have tried to cut out as much of the political b****x as possible from this thread, and move it into the new one.

NB - this is actually very difficult, because of overlapping conversations. I've also moved stuff if it wasn't political, but didn't make sense if left here.

Apologies if you disagree with the way I've split the thread, but I've done my best, and it's taken over an hour of reading impartially.


Now continue!!



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Post by Tuppence »

PS, just to add, it's my personal opinion that naybody who has only ever posted to one thread, or on one topic, clearly has their own agenda.
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Post by Tuppence »

to clarify, after a pm.

feel free to continue the discussion, but leave the politics to the other thread for the most part.

i.e. this one's now for discussion of the event itself, improving the event etc.

on which note it does strike me that if what those who went say is true (can't see any reason for it not to be) then the organisers are cracking down and it could have a bright future!

lack of beer tent thoguh - not good sign - it's one of the big reasons to go to most big events in england, and is ind of expected at multi society bashes, so if you want the english to turn up en masse, it would be worth sorting out.

plus another potential income stream for the organisers :D
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Post by guthrie »

Well, there is a pub or two nearby, but I am not sure how good they are. I seem to recall having an ok meal in one of them 3 years ago.

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Post by Tuppence »

yeah, but pub isn't beer tent.

for a start off site, and for a second, usually about a quarter of the size and full of locals...
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Post by Alan_F »

And it's good to have a communal focus for the site.

I'm pretty sure the local breweries such as Harviestoun would be happy to provide or there are the people who supply re-enactment events.

It would be good to have a few more traders there as well - a lot of Scottish groups don't go to big events in England and therefore miss out on the chance to buy new shiny things.
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Post by zauberdachs »

guthrie wrote:Well, there is a pub or two nearby, but I am not sure how good they are. I seem to recall having an ok meal in one of them 3 years ago.
the 1314 is one of those pubs where you feel stupid going in without a dog.
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Post by Hobbitstomper »

Thanks for the Scottish clothing links.

There is also a picture of a scotsman in the paperback book called "Bannockburn" that apparently comes from the margin of a period book. Unfortunately it didn't say which one :(

Not very relevant but the Norwegian pictures from the period (on the stave churches) have people in long tunics.

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Post by zauberdachs »

Hobbitstomper wrote: There is also a picture of a scotsman in the paperback book called "Bannockburn" that apparently comes from the margin of a period book. Unfortunately it didn't say which one :(
There's one that's often used, I think it's from the English Exchequer?
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Post by Nigel »

Alan_F wrote:And it's good to have a communal focus for the site.

It would be good to have a few more traders there as well - a lot of Scottish groups don't go to big events in England and therefore miss out on the chance to buy new shiny things.
True BUT its a calculation is it worth coming up with all the expense it entails to possibly sell something

Bannockburn is still a high risk event form that point of view
There’s a country in Europe where they treat their ex soldiers with pride no waits for medical treatment after injuries received during service, no amensia from the government. Cant for the life of me recall where it is but I know exactly where it is not.

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Post by Lady Wolfshead »

Definitely agree with having a beer tent over going to any local pub. Bannockburn needs a communal area where English and Scottish groups can mix together, that way if anyone or group decides to get stupidly patriotic, others can sit on them - in a friendly way! :)

On the point of traders, it was very disappointing this year to only see two/three authentic traders. I was really hoping to buy cloth from Bernie or Ali, I'm also needing a thin belt for my kit and could do with a better pouch. I have always bought stuff in the past precisely because it is so difficult for us to buy stuff up north. This is clearly an area that needs to be looked at for next year and I think decent advertising in advance (to re-enactors and the public) would make it a less risky option for traders.

Furthermore, as we encourage better groups to take part in Bannockburn (ie. not the Braveheart types) I think there will be a greater market for the traders.

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Post by Nigel »

For leather stuff Sallie Deans of pipistrelle in Scotland is where Conquest now flock

belts scababrds pouches we ahve em all top quality work and good prices
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Post by Lady Cecily »

Hobbitstomper wrote: Not very relevant but the Norwegian pictures from the period (on the stave churches) have people in long tunics.
Actually Hobbitstomper I think that the Norwegian (and Greenland) evidence has great relavance for parts of what is now Scotland. The Western Isles and Highlands probably had more cultural contact with Norway than mainland Europe at this period.

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Post by Hobbitstomper »

Okay in that case...

My book about the late 13th/early 14th century paintings in the Norwegan stave churches has no plaid in it whatsoever. Lots of people in long flowing tunics though.

Must stop buying obscure second hand books.

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Post by Lady Cecily »

Hobbitstomper wrote:Okay in that case...

My book about the late 13th/early 14th century paintings in the Norwegan stave churches has no plaid in it whatsoever. Lots of people in long flowing tunics though.

Must stop buying obscure second hand books.
Any chance of a full reference for this book please? Sounds interesting............ jeez I am sad.
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Post by guthrie »

Hobbitstomper wrote: Must stop buying obscure second hand books.
Goodie, that'll leave more for me then.

Have you found that it is harder and harder to get hold of obscure second hand books? Charity shops have gone all professional, and real 2nd hand shops are often either over priced or do not seek out decent stock.

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Post by Hobbitstomper »

Will look it up tonight but it was published about 40 years ago.

Most second hand book stores seem to have got internet links so they put anything decent on Amazon.

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Post by m300572 »

Actually Hobbitstomper I think that the Norwegian (and Greenland) evidence has great relavance for parts of what is now Scotland. The Western Isles and Highlands probably had more cultural contact with Norway than mainland Europe at this period
If memory serves me correct (but I am quite happy to be corrected on the date) the Northern Isles were part of Denmark until the 15th Century when they were ceded to Scotland as part of a royal dowry. The Northern Isles, the Western Isles and Caithness and Sutherland ('The land in the south' not very accurate as a descrition relative to Great Britain) were all areas of strong Viking settlement and influence. As was pointed out, the sea was a significant transport medium in the past.
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Post by Lady Cecily »

The death of Margaret, Maid of Norway in 1290 was what starts this whole war.

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Post by RottenCad »

guthrie wrote:
Hobbitstomper wrote: Must stop buying obscure second hand books.
Goodie, that'll leave more for me then.

Have you found that it is harder and harder to get hold of obscure second hand books? Charity shops have gone all professional, and real 2nd hand shops are often either over priced or do not seek out decent stock.
Believe it or not old boy, this is the fault of Oxfam. Because they are the largest retailer of second hand books in the UK now, their pricing is distorting the pricing recommendation guides of all the other outlets. One example that you will doubtless appreciate is Oxfam asking £40.00 for a 1st edition of "Biggles and the Cruise of the Condor" - one of the commonest Biggles books around - no dustjacket either.

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Post by Alan_F »

Nigel wrote:
Alan_F wrote:And it's good to have a communal focus for the site.

It would be good to have a few more traders there as well - a lot of Scottish groups don't go to big events in England and therefore miss out on the chance to buy new shiny things.
True BUT its a calculation is it worth coming up with all the expense it entails to possibly sell something

Bannockburn is still a high risk event form that point of view
If the event were to have a re-enactors market with it do you think that would be a better move?
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Post by Nigel »

mercanry head on

Why trade at an event only orth doing if you have a good chance of covering costs

Plus enjoyment factor given the "happenings" at previous events you would be pretty much tid to your stall even after hours

So ou would need to offer a good market in terms of numbers and a secure environment

That said DEBS has a habit of picking up orders just by standing still (best one was discussing an order over lunch at a wedding much to the weird looks of other non reenacotrs at that table) so doesn't really feel the need to trade so perhaps we are not the best folsk to ask.

Table cloths make good drawing things though
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Post by Alan_F »

Nigel wrote:So ou would need to offer a good market in terms of numbers and a secure environment
I think something that should be looked at is improved security - a couple of security officers on overnight is less than adequate, the site needs at least 4, with two on constant patrol and one response vehicle.
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Post by Hinny Annie »

On the trading front I can only speak for us., and these are only my views.

We have traded at Bannockburn we also go to Lanark and have been there since it started, whilst we do appreciate that it takes a few years to get established this is our living and just like every other trader we have criterea as to which events we trade at. No event organiser can guarantee us xxx number of pounds and we are fully aware of that, and that is the risk we take but as we dont sell to the public the re-enactors have to be there, which unfortunately for us, rules Bannockburn out at the moment.

This is a shame as for us as living in Northumberland, Scotland is much easier to get to than most of the English events. Also June is not a good month for Traders as there is already loads on.

So for all you Scottish Archers, we will be at Lanark
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Post by Alan_F »

:?

So if there was better security and more re-enactors we'd get more traders?
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Post by Lady Wolfshead »

So if there was better security and more re-enactors we'd get more traders?
That seems fair enough and it would make the event better for all concerned to have more of both anyway. :)

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