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13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Sat Oct 24, 2009 10:42 pm
by Templar Knight
I messed up the leather on my scabbard :wasntme: , so the wood is showing at the top which doesnt look very good. I thought covering it up with a locket might improve it but cant find examples of any from 13th Century. Has anybody got, pics, recommendations of what to do or anything of the such?

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:55 am
by Nigel
contact Henry somerset on here he makes em and they are rather nice

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:47 pm
by Colin Middleton
AFAIK, you're looking at leather facings on the 13th C scabards, though an expert may be able to say otherwise. One possibility (though I don't think it's that authentic) would be to fit a leather 'throat' at the top of the scabard to hide the bit that didn't fit will.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 9:42 pm
by Templar Knight
Well, the sword itself is not for combat, was given it as a gift and thought it would be good chance to practice making a scabbard, so its only for home display, where people like us wont judge its authenticity so for simplicity I am going for a metal locket. Collin what does AFAIK mean?

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 1:30 pm
by Colin Middleton
I hope that it means "As Far As I Know".

If not, I've been making a bit of a fool of myself elsewhere! :worried:

There was a topic on these kind of acronyms in the Help section if you find any others that you don't know.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 3:58 pm
by Andreas
I agree with Colin, to my knowledge metal "lockets" (correct term?) are coming into use during the 14th century. 13th century scabbards are pretty famous for being connected to the belt by intricate leather knotwork. The scabbard itself often runs out in a leather triangle covering the quillon/hilt. Osprey might help re pictures.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:31 pm
by Templar Knight
That was what I was trying to do, have the leather triangle, but the leather must of tightened up when I sewed it and it is to far down so the core is showing.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 6:48 pm
by Nigel
ophs was thinking of chapes and throats

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:48 pm
by Colin Middleton
I thought that 'throat' was another word for what we're discussing?

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 2:28 pm
by Medicus Matt
Colin Middleton wrote:I thought that 'throat' was another word for what we're discussing?
It is. Although 'throat' can just refer to the leather part of the scabbard that extends up to cover part of the quillions whereas lockets are always a seperate feature.

Metal throats/lockets/whatever are unusual in the 13th C .. don't think that there are any in the 'Jeff' psalter...(that's the maciejowski for those who don't know) ..the contrasting band around the mouth of some of the scabbard seen there seems to be of leather.

Too late for you now TK but next time either thoroughly pre-stretch your leather prior to marking and stitching or leave plenty of surplus at the mouth end and don't form and stitch that end until you've let the whole thing dry out properly.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:46 pm
by Templar Knight
Oh, I did stretch it, but I thought you then sewed it on while still damp from being stretched. I cut out another piece of leather with the triangles which I could stitch around the top but it looks a bit chunky so I am trying to decide on that or the metal locket even thought its not authentic as far as we know.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 10:19 am
by Medicus Matt
Templar Knight wrote:Oh, I did stretch it, but I thought you then sewed it on while still damp from being stretched. .
You do stitch it whilst it's still damp but only after you've stretched it thoroughly in all directions (not just pulled it about a bit). If you do this properly then you only get a small amount of final shrinkage.

What thickness of leather did you use? I'm assuming that it was undyed veg-tan?

Personally I'd redo the leather and put it down to experience.

Re: 13th Century Sword Lockets

Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:42 pm
by Templar Knight
It was cowhide veg tan about 1.5 mm
Seeing as it isnt going to be used for reenactment events and I dont have the money or time to redo It I am going to keep it with that and either put a leather wrap with a triangle on arnourd the top or just use a metal locket.